2ZZ-GE Swap With No Cuts-- Discussion

[Santa Barbarian]

Either a VR5 or 6 should fit, they are just heavy beasts. They sound great.

My other love to see it fits is the Mazda KL twin cam V6. They sound wicked and there is a 2.0l which was available in the Lantis, put out 200hp (more if you go with the physically identical 2.5kl) and there are 5 and 6 speed transmissions which fit up.

This raises the other problem of front to back space but one could sacrifice some of the trunk (which I would hate to do).

Anywho, drive on. Pics when you start stuffing the 2ZZ-GE in there.

I think the early aughts Mazda I4 is probably in the "fits pretty well" category too.

Those M66s I bought are for another *ahem* more "out there" idea for one of my Scorpions. At one point I doubted that the Scorp was really designed to take a Busso-- but comparing the two engine bays? Night and day difference compared to the Xer. The Lancia would take a lot of interesting hardware.... short of the Quattroporte V8 I have here, I guess.

I'll have to wait on posting about the Scorpion transplant-- it's so nutty it might actually work. Or it might be embarrassing.

Worst case on the X-roller? I have a 1300 cc motorcycle engine sitting there-- it's like "the back up car on Top Gear". I don't want to resort to it-- but...

 

[Santa Barbarian]

What is the length of a 2ZZ from pulley face to trans mount face? And do the up spec 6 speeds have LSD?

I know what you mean about these JDM motors especially the higher spec version. Unless you stumble on them in the junk yards the prices are a bit of a shock. To get a K20 i bought the whole car. The 07Ks seem to be a $500 motor all day long at the yards Which is nice. A VR5 would be nice but those are 4K here.

Here is a scan of the package. The 07K is a surprisingly compact motor considering the 2.5 litres and extra pot. I wish I did a scan of the X1.5 with the trans for comparison, face to face the 07K is only a hair under and inch longer than the 1.5. 465mm to 490mm. roughtly 18.3 inches to 19.3 inches.

View attachment 67012

I"m in the midst of three other projects-- and am basically consumed until late-Bowl-Season on other commitments.

But, I did make the discovery this week that an F23 (Getrag) is a full two inches shorter than the already-short FIAT box. So, if the stock Toyota 6MT can't get her done? My back-up position will be "2ZZ, custom intake, modified harness/CPU and F23 Getrag".... should fit in the tiniest of spots in there. I'll fire up the mill over the holidays to make some test pieces.

More later, but there is hope.

 

[Dr.Jeff]

I think the early aughts Mazda I4 is probably in the "fits pretty well" category too.

I had the same thought. I was looking at a Ford drivetrain when Karl enlightened me it's actually a Mazda that Ford shared. I think it might be a much easier swap overall than the Honda K's, etc. And they're readily available cheap with the complete donor car.

 

[Santa Barbarian]

I had the same thought. I was looking at a Ford drivetrain when Karl enlightened me it's actually a Mazda that Ford shared. I think it might be a much easier swap overall than the Honda K's, etc. And they're readily available cheap with the complete donor car.

I didn't realize that the Getrag box was that small-- but I'm encouraged that, as a back-up plan, it might work on the 2ZZ. Still hoping the Toyota stock 6MT works out, but I'm working through the combinations.

 

[Bobkat]

I didn't realize that the Getrag box was that small-- but I'm encouraged that, as a back-up plan, it might work on the 2ZZ. Still hoping the Toyota stock 6MT works out, but I'm working through the combinations.

The F23 (Getrag) looks interesting as it is so common in so many GM cars. Junk yards would be full of them. Looks like there are cheap LSD options for them also. There seems to be a bit of and argument on how much torque they could handle though big range from 150-500. Factory says 170.

 

[kmead]

I didn't realize that the Getrag box was that small-- but I'm encouraged that, as a back-up plan, it might work on the 2ZZ. Still hoping the Toyota stock 6MT works out, but I'm working through the combinations.

Another possibility is the Fiat C635 which is short for the same reasons the F23 is, it uses three shafts rather than two. It makes the gear box deeper front to rear. This transmission was used in the Fiat 500L, 500X Jeep Renegade, Jeep Compass and Dodge Dart.

I would look at any box carefully for ratios to ensure they are suited to the 2ZZ GE which is a bit torque weak. Many of these newer boxes in US guise are geared long to maximize economy. Our Jeep Compass has this transmission and we are happy with it aside from 6th gear being rarely used due to low HP and torque in a heavy SUV.

 

[My1stCar]

I would look at any box carefully for ratios to ensure they are suited to the 2ZZ GE which is a bit torque weak.

This is an important thing to consider. You also should factor in the change of tire dimensions between donor vehicle and the X.
I understood the X's standard tire diameter to be 562mm, which is much smaller than most modern cars, so that would compensate partly the longer gearing of more recent gearboxes. (In my case the tire diameter goes from 632 to 562, or about 12% shorter)

Best regards, Marc

 

[Santa Barbarian]

I would look at any box carefully for ratios to ensure they are suited to the 2ZZ GE which is a bit torque weak. Many of these newer boxes in US guise are geared long to maximize economy. Our Jeep Compass has this transmission and we are happy with it aside from 6th gear being rarely used due to low HP and torque in a heavy SUV.

You raise a great point. It appears that the "best of the type" in the F23s is actually the one that came in a MANUAL HHR, which had shorter gearing for the heavier GVWR of the HHR over the sedan chassis'.

By luck, the F23 I picked up is a HHR version.

And, yep, that 3-shaft design does result in a less-lengthy case.

 

[Santa Barbarian]

The F23 (Getrag) looks interesting as it is so common in so many GM cars. Junk yards would be full of them. Looks like there are cheap LSD options for them also. There seems to be a bit of and argument on how much torque they could handle though big range from 150-500. Factory says 170.

Yeah, they used it in a lot of high-volume models. I think I paid $200 for this HHR version (shorter gear'd) I bought.

 

[Bobkat]

This is an important thing to consider. You also should factor in the change of tire dimensions between donor vehicle and the X.
I understood the X's standard tire diameter to be 562mm, which is much smaller than most modern cars, so that would compensate partly the longer gearing of more recent gearboxes. (In my case the tire diameter goes from 632 to 562, or about 12% shorter)

Best regards, Marc

for my swap I have already fitted larger tires to try to get closer to match what the new trans was made for. I have really grown to love the bigger tire for ride quality and cruising. Funny the X speedo is really generous. My GPS speedo with the larger tires matches the X speedo exactly now.