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  #1  
Old Jul 13 2011, 5:11 pm
TonyK TonyK is online now
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Fiat 500 Service Manual.

The Quest has begun.

I stopped at the dealer and asked to purchase a Fiat 500 2012 Service Manual. The counter person left and came back with the Service manager and a phone number 1-800-387-1143 I called it and talked to a lady named Hirlanda who gave me a web site www.techauthority.com I search this site and found only the owners manual and an auto body manual that is in PDF format and is free. I called Hirlanda back telling her the service manual was not on that website and she told me to call back in a day and would find out more information. The following day I called back and was given this phone number 1-800-465-2001 and after a long wait I talked to Emily , she spent 30 minutes with me and put me on hold serveral times. She even made the statement that only a dealer can work on the car as to not void the warantee. This is not what the saleman told me when I was in the dealership with my son when he purchased the car. She insisted that at the techauthority website I could purchase access to the information in 1, 3, 30 days and 1 year. I told her I could not see where to purchase this information. Finally she used another computer and realized that she could not see it either so... She finally gave me a phone number for WiTech 1-888-948-3241 and after a wait on hold I talked to Ameil who could not offer anything and put me on hold twice as well. He then gave me a web address of fiatform.com this is a promo site but someone has posted how to change the oil on the new Fiat 500. Guess what the car uses a cartridge oil filter that is upside down. I haven't see this type of filter since I worked on a 1976 Dodge 800 truck with a 413 V8 engine. The post has pictures on this form but makes no mention of where to buy a filter. ( I will guess at a dealer) I tried at Car Quest but they didn't have a listing for the Fiat 500.

Ameil gave me the following phone numbers that I have not had a chance to try yet. So far I have spent 1 hour and 15 minutes on the phone trying to get a straight answer for information on how to do repairs on this car or obtain information of how to do it.

I was directed to try and sort it out with the following.

Fiat USA 1-888-242-6342
Fiat Canada 1-800-521-9900

Web address fiatcanada.com

1-416-422-2272
1-855-422-2272

I have not had time to try out those phone numbers for what seems to be the Royal Run Around.

I am getting close to launching a complaint with Transport Canada. Similar complaints agains Acura forced Acura to release information about their cars as owners and small shops had no information to offer customers and to do repairs.

Opinion, After years of being loyal to the brand after they left North America and seeing Fiat return I am greatly disapointed that once again I am left to fend for myself or throw myself to the mercy of the dealer. Of those that know me on this form, what I can't repair I will build and my loyality is waining currently. Next week the Fiat Rep will be in Nashville I am going to have ask a few questions about this. If I am missing something here and anyone has some direction please let me know. I find is disapointing that I will be forced to drive 30 miles for an oil change when I have a lift in my garage and tools to do it.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
  #2  
Old Jul 13 2011, 5:45 pm
Carl_Auer Carl_Auer is offline
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I found

http://www.yousaytoo.com/manual-serv...at-500c/722609

But that is all. It seems to me, it was a little while after the new models came out before Haynes or Chilton books were available. In fact, IIRC there was never a Haynes Manual for the FI X1/9's. I remember having a book that said "covering all years of the Fiat X1/9 including Fuel Injection Cars" and all the I would expect that you will have better luck on the 500 forums finding out specifics on self servicing of the new 500.
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  #3  
Old Jul 13 2011, 6:24 pm
Matthew Matthew is offline
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I have the Haynes manual for the X1/9 and it is not very good.

There is a good possibility there will never be a factory manual for the 500. Most manufacturers are going to online service information. You may have to buy a subscription to the Fiat/Chrysler service information website if you want factory info.
  #4  
Old Jul 13 2011, 7:19 pm
TonyK TonyK is online now
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Tried that.

But Fiat/Chrysler would not give me the link or site to purchase any information. Reason, I was not a dealer. So far this stinks. I am sure there is a law passed in the USA that cars sold in the USA must have information available. We are not talking a quarter of a million dollare Lambo here made in very limited numbers. This is a $16K car.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
  #5  
Old Jul 13 2011, 7:34 pm
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Dan Sarandrea (Phila) Dan Sarandrea (Phila) is offline
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Just as an FYI a later edition of the Haynes manual was published with a couple of supplemental chapters added to cover the change from 1300/4sp to 1500/5sp, and there was no coverage of the FI model as that was almost exclusively a USA car, and after all the orientation of the Haynes manuals has always been thoroughly British in nature.
  #6  
Old Jul 13 2011, 7:44 pm
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Dan Sarandrea (Phila) Dan Sarandrea (Phila) is offline
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Not sure about the legalities of repair work in The Great White North, but in the USA the federal Magnuson-Moss Act passed many years ago established that owners would not forfeit warranty coverage if they had local shops do routine maintenance as long as the parts and materials (oils, lubes, and etc) they used met factory specifications.

Whether or not aftermarket suppliers gear up to produce normal maintenance items like oil, air and fuel filters, spark plugs and the like, is something that I would imagine would be demand-driven. In the meantime, it should be expected that if the car is using an oddball filter, sources for such oddball filters are going to be limited....and maybe for the first few oil changes, may be a dealer-only item, till the aftermarket decides to jump into the market.

Does anyone know if the North American 500 uses the same filters as the Euro model? If so, it should be easy to source them from Europe, as there have been half a million 500s made over there.
  #7  
Old Jul 13 2011, 8:22 pm
Matthew Matthew is offline
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This is where you will be able to get a manual

But they aren't a there yet

https://www.techauthority.com/en-US/Pages/Home.aspx
  #8  
Old Jul 13 2011, 8:28 pm
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JimD JimD is offline
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Body repair manual

Not that it helps Tony, but it looks like the collision repair manual is online and free to access:

https://a.srs20.spx.com/OEM/Chrysler...ook/index.html

Nice interface too.
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  #9  
Old Jul 14 2011, 4:01 am
TonyK TonyK is online now
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Posted on the UK Site.

I am a member of the UK X1/9 form and have had a response from someone that works on the Euro Model.

As for aftermarket parts, nothing yet so it looks like I will be forced to go to the dealer for parts. I surely hope Fiat Dealers will sell parts to customers.

The US laws are similar to Canadian laws which allow owners to purchase warrentee spec parts and do service on their vehicles.

That said, most of us just went forward and maintained our cars and did repairs after Fiat left North America, so being on our own isn't a big deal.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada
  #10  
Old Jul 14 2011, 1:05 pm
TonyK TonyK is online now
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According to the UK

The filter for the Euro Fiat 500 is made by Fram

And depends on the size.

100 MM CH0047ECO

85 MM CH 9713ECO

I don't have time to search the numbers at the Jobbers, but will after I come back from FFO.

In the mean time I purchased a cartridge filter from Chrysler for the car $14 USD???? Plus taxes 13%, Just nuts. Even the part counter person could not believe the price of the Cartridge filter.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.

Last edited by TonyK; Jul 14 2011 at 2:57 pm.
  #11  
Old Jul 14 2011, 2:33 pm
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SpidArman SpidArman is offline
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the local Fiat dealer

tried to charge me $38USD yesterday for the cartridge and then talked me out of changing my own oil due to strick Fiat "rules" about changing the "Break-in" oil early. Pure Bull$#!t
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  #12  
Old Jul 14 2011, 2:55 pm
TonyK TonyK is online now
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Strict Rules?

I don't know about the USA but dealerships here charge $103 per hour of shop time. Sure an oil change will be less as a package, but you have to book an apointment and drive 30 miles or more for an oil change. Loyality will wain if Fiat pushes this too far as other cars don't have these issues. This is not a high end car. If this is what Fiat wants they better spell it out clearly before you purchase the car. Like it is your car and nobody but a Fiat Dealer can work on it. Hell no one but me has ever worked on my 79 X, what a drasitic change.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
  #13  
Old Jul 30 2011, 7:50 pm
TonyK TonyK is online now
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Update the quest continues.

After the banquet at FFO 2011 I waited to talk to Laura Soave, the people working for her were trying to get her out of the room. I managed to spend about 5 minutes in conversation with her about trying to obtain information on the Fiat 500 Service manual.

Just a note here last year my wife purchased an Infinity G37W all wheel drive car $56,000 a month after purchase I paid $25 for a PDF 1 gig. file for the service manual that included 5 years of form access. In a word resonable.

I explained to Laura that I live in Canada and that service for the car is not included in the purchase of the new car. Unlike some of the owners attending the show, the Fiat dealer the USA is driving 2 hours to pick the car up and do an oil change for nothing. Yet on these forms I explained that the pricing for oil filters go from $14 to $38 and asked the question why? Laura stated that parts pricing was left to the descression of the dealers and prices will vary. I also explained that no one has ever worked on my car but me and that I did not want the access codes to Fiat's software but access to service information to service and repair the car. She turned to one of her aids and stated that we need to talk to Mopar about this and was asked for my email address.

I also explained to her that I convinced my son to purchase this car and in return my son expects me to help him with repairs. My son Scott loves the car and has no issues with the product.

Fiat abandoned their owners in December of 1981 in Canada. Many of us learned how to do simple work on our cars, but Fiat must be mindful that if all repairs to be done lead owners back only to dealerships, support and interest in the car will wobble and Honda and Toyota both build similar cars and information and after market parts are available.

She thank me for sharing my comments and I was told that someone would get back to me with a resolution. So for now I am still waiting, we all are waiting.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada
  #14  
Old Jul 31 2011, 4:33 am
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roadbox roadbox is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpidArman View Post
tried to charge me $38USD yesterday for the cartridge and then talked me out of changing my own oil due to strick Fiat "rules" about changing the "Break-in" oil early. Pure Bull$#!t
I'm curious, here. We just bought a new 500 on Friday ...or rather, my good woman did, and part of why I like it for her is that all the routine maintenance like oil changes are free for the first three years if done at the dealer. Like with the Toyota/Scion she traded in, she also bought the extended warranty. So where I like this is that, unlike my X, I don't have to be an expert on her car as there are already people paid to be that. Thus, like with her Scion, I may never need to know the specs on either oil or filter; I consider this among the many joys of new car ownership. I thought this was a Fiat thing, but maybe it's just our dealer.

EDIT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyK View Post
...I live in Canada and that service for the car is not included in the purchase of the new car. Unlike some of the owners attending the show, the Fiat dealer the USA is driving 2 hours to pick the car up and do an oil change for nothing... I also explained to her that I convinced my son to purchase this car and in return my son expects me to help him with repairs... Fiat abandoned their owners in December of 1981 in Canada. Many of us learned how to do simple work on our cars...
After reading the thread a bit more carefully, Tony K. answers most of my questions. However, for US owners with a truly local dealer (ours is a 10 minute drive), why not let the dealer do the work if it's already including in the warranty?

John O.
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Last edited by roadbox; Jul 31 2011 at 5:26 am. Reason: Got it!
  #15  
Old Jul 31 2011, 5:09 am
TonyK TonyK is online now
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It appears

To be a USA/Canada border thing. When I stated to Laura about oil changes she looked a bit perplexed so I mentioned that the car was purchased in Canada. She replied, oh.

When the car was purchased I was with my son and there was no mention of any service being included with the purchase. The car was purchased as commuter and Scott drives it 50 miles one way to work each day. Traffic can cause this to be an hour and a half drive each way as well. Scott is rarely home before 6:30 PM any week day. This means going to the dealer for an oil change is a 30 mile drive and would have to be done on Saturday mornings, when on the other side of the coin, I have a car hoist in my garage and do it for him when the car is here at home it takes only 30 minutes which is due to the complexity of access to the drain plug and filter on this car. I can change the oil on my X, Infinity and Dodge Ram truck in half that time.

TonyK.


Grimsby Ontario Canada.
  #16  
Old Jul 31 2011, 5:38 am
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roadbox roadbox is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyK View Post
The car was purchased as commuter and Scott drives it 50 miles one way to work each day. Traffic can cause this to be an hour and a half drive each way as well. Scott is rarely home before 6:30 PM any week day. This means going to the dealer for an oil change is a 30 mile drive and would have to be done on Saturday mornings...
The commute you described is very common here in the Washington DC area. It is almost exactly the commute my good woman drives every day. It's a crap shoot when she'll get home in the evenings. So, this is where you kind of lose me because, in order for my good woman to have her Scion serviced at the dealer, she has religiously (for the past 5 years) done exactly what you are suggesting is not reasonable, gotten her ass out of bed early to be the first one at the Toyota dealership on a Saturday morning. It's cool that you are helping your son with maintenance of his car, but this is also a good opportunity for you to teach him self-reliance and that the things you cherish in life often take work and sacrifice. Sorry if I sound a little preachy there, but I'm just trying to lend perspective.

Now, if this is something you like because it gets the two of you together on the weekend ...well, then that's different.

John O.
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'86 Bertone (Ray Betts special, Springs, Konis, Plaia pivots & "bigfeet", A/C)
'76 Scorpion (Whoas, Springs, Konis)
'82 Spider 2K (The Good Woman's, but I'm the Chief Mechanic)
'13 Fiat 500 Abarth (mine, black w/white wheels)
'13 Fiat 500 Abarth (The Good Woman's, red w/black wheels)
'82 Dodge Ram D150/1500
'74 MGB-GT (Derek's, always will be...)
Please God, No More!

Last edited by roadbox; Jul 31 2011 at 5:57 am.
  #17  
Old Jul 31 2011, 8:16 am
TonyK TonyK is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roadbox View Post
She has religiously (for the past 5 years) done exactly what you are suggesting is not reasonable, gotten her ass out of bed early to be the first one at the Toyota dealership on a Saturday morning. It's cool that you are helping your son with maintenance of his car, but this is also a good opportunity for you to teach him self-reliance and that the things you cherish in life often take work and sacrifice. Sorry if I sound a little preachy there, but I'm just trying to lend perspective.

Now, if this is something you like because it gets the two of you together on the weekend ...well, then that's different.

John O.

Personally I can't see why he has to spend a morning to get an oil change at dealer and then pay the added expense to have it done. $70 for an oil change by my standards is kind of high for what it is.

The point here of this thread is owners and small shops should have access to information about this car and also be able to purchase parts from suppliers not just a dealer. This is a $16K car not something for $200K that could come with conditions.

If Scott had the option to get a Free oil change that would put a different spin on it. He is just starting out and currently every dollar counts. So from my perspective Paying money for an over priced oil change at a dealer and wasting a morning is more than I think is reasonable. Possibly if you had to shell out $70 as well you would think a bit differently about this. What you were offered with the car isn't what we have here in Canada.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
  #18  
Old Jul 31 2011, 8:31 am
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budgetzagato budgetzagato is offline
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Warranty

As far as I know, here in the US anyone can service their own car and, as long as they follow the published recommendations, it will keep any warranty in force. This is assuming you can get the parts I guess.
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  #19  
Old Jul 31 2011, 8:57 am
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  #20  
Old Jul 31 2011, 10:43 am
so cal mark so cal mark is offline
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Even with free oil changes, Fiat will only do them at 8000 mile intervals. That's twice the distance I go between changes. I've been talking with a rep in Fiat Marketing about service info and he has been unable to help with any answers other than "it's coming soon".
As for filters, OEM, an aftermarket supplier is advertising a full line of filters for the 500. I do know that IAP carries the OEM ignition line for the 124 Spider but I don't know if they're carrying 500 parts.
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